A few readers have complained about “apples and oranges” matchups…but I hope they realize it’s impossible to organize this kind of elimination contest with nothing but similar designs. The Lugger vs. Monty 15 matchup is classic in that they both have huge followings and they’re in the same general size range, but they’re light years apart in other respects…suggesting we’ll continue to see at least different kinds of apples as we approach the final showdown. Anyhow, Lugger vs. Monty 15 is a really tough call: I have enormous respect for both designs, but I’ve got to go with the Montgomery 15, since I’ve owned one, know how well they sail in various conditions, appreciate their sleep-aboard advantages, and just love their overall design.
Well, this is like comparing the person you are happily married to someone you dreamed off back in high school. The Monty gets my vote- how could I betray her as she sits in my garage? About the best 15 ft cruiser there is- the cabin has no pretense of holding anything but a berth, but what a big and surprisingly comfortable berth it is (as I was once told, think of it as a supremely comfortable backpacking tent- I can't imagine another 15 footer that my wife would gladly chose over her bed at home), and she sails so well- leaving one cutting through waves, hiking stick in hand, laughing at all the tubbier boats hobby horsing in the chop. And if you have a question on the email group, Jerry- who build your boat in 1985- may ask for your number so he can call to talk through a repair you asked for advice on- and share some crazy stories too. And great build quality- I always enjoy getting to tell people who ask if she is new that no, she's older than you probably are... Oh, and pulling in and having her on the trailer and ready to take home in 30 min, and then offering your help to the friend still de-rigging a Catalina 22 who started an hour before you got there, there's a certain satisfaction in that too. True, you can nose her up to a beach, but don't want to ground her out at low tide, and yes, she's a two person boat- the cockpit looks like it has more room, but really, even three are a crowd and mess with sailing ability, and, no, she's not the boat to take around Vancouver Island- but dang she better win this whole dang thing. But yes, there is still the Dracombe, and I will admit- please don't tell my Monty- that sometimes I do still dream of her.
Wow, I think the left bracket was just a warm up. This first match up in the right bracket is the real deal.
I noticed the smaller boat usually won the matchup in the left bracket (exceptions are the WWP 15 vs Peep Hen and Sea Pearl 21 vs Ranger 20). Also, the winners are all cabin equipped boats except for the Sea Pearl, SF Pelican, and SCAMP. So, maybe I’ll vote for the DL just to buck the trend…
Out of all the boats in this madness I think the DL has the most soul and character. Despite it being a production boat I imagine one could really form a long friendship with this one. As miles passed under the keel a rich patina would develop on the hands and bronze alike.
How can you vote against the M15 though? It’s a fan favorite and proven to be capable. Well, for me it’s got two strikes against it. It’s just a little too small for my needs - I just want more waterline length and storage space. Also, the stub keel prevents beaching and shallow water exploring. I’ve already voted for the M17 anyway, so this round goes to the DL.
I am a bit bias about picking a Drascombe having owned 2 luggers, a Cruiser and now a Coaster.
I believe the Coaster to be a much better fit for this draw having a cabin for overnights and a large cockpit to spread out in. I have learnt over the years that the small lug sail on all these Drascombes is far more useful for more than just sailing.
Both great boats, but we like Lugger for her day sailing, muck about skinny water capabilities. Take 5 friends with you. Versatile sail plan. Viable rowboat and easy access to motor. Easy to rig. But if camping is your thing and a cabin is desired...
Full disclosure, Skipper has had her Lugger for 40 years.
Of all the boats in this gunfight, there is one who clearly checks more boxes than any other, with respect to offering more joy to more people. I was an "associate member' of the old SOCAL Potters, and sailed regularly against and with Sean's band of Monty brigands to the east in Havasu. And I have been cruising with those delightful little spit kits consistently ever since. That I regularly managed to out foot and out point the lot of them with a similar pocket cruiser of my own frankenmanufacture I believe gives me a rare access to the catbird seat. Sure, they could be faster and more handy and easier to rig, even to get back on the trailer. But. Those little M-15's do more of the jobs listed, right out of the carton, than any other boat in this dog and pony show. Dan
This is painful. Without a doubt, Montgomery 15's are great, practical boats and crackerjack sailers, with a well deserved reputation for quality build, representing a very well chosen set of compromises for a boat of this size and type.
But, it is hard to vote against the Drascombe Lugger, even though I always thought Webb Chiles was more than a little crazy for attempting a long ocean voyage in one. Every time I read his book, I'd come away thinking, "Nope. Give me a solid little yawl (Gilmer's Blue Moon?) which will heave to or lie ahull like a well corked bottle when things get snotty, not something more like a small casserole dish with no lid just waiting to feed you to the sharks." But, dangit, the things just look *salty* in a way only designs derived from 19th century British fishing boats can, even if part of that look is a loose footed mainsail which would likely do much better with a well vanged boom, and a mizzen which wants a sprit boom or some other arrangement to make it useful for anything much more than a riding sail. Even with that tricky rudder arrangement (see Phil Boger's Chebacco and some others for a better way to achieve the same end, in my opinion), you just have to love the looks of 'em, hence my totally irrational vote. <;-)
I watched as elderly, but experienced, sailors capsized their lugger in about 8’ of water in early Oct. (Chesapeake Bay). Wind was 15kts gusting to 20. The boat immediately filled. Centerboard case was below the filled waterline. The boat then flooded freely through the centerboard case and the outboard well.The boat was unrecoverable and the couple had to be rescued, the boat pulled to shore to be bailed. This is an unsafe boat without signifcant modifications. Fails. Also boat is pokey slow in light airs.
We had a M-15 and a M-17. The M-15 was so much easier to tow, launch and retrieve, it was comfortable for the two of us to sleep aboard, and it handled heavy weather sailing very well. This is one of the boats I wish I would have kept, particularly now that we are 75. John and Joy
The Lugger is the best small sailboat in your contest. If I had bought this boat first she would have been my only sailboat. And saved me a small fortune.
I voted for the DL because it is more versatile, can probably carry more gear, has better sail combination choices, and is probably easier to set up at the launch ramp.
A cabin on that small of boat may be cozy, but it often gets in the way. Really, for a boat that size, a half-decked, or even an open boat, may be the better option, if it has high sides and sufficient emergency flotation.
Monty 15….I’ve had THREE!!! #318, #670,#742!! My all time favorite boats…They check off, ALL the boxes!…And I’ve had more than a few. (last count…somewhat north of 15)…were it not for the Monty’s, I would have voted for the Drascombe.
No problem making a Lugger self rescueable; we've been doing it with racing dinghies for years before fancy built in tanks. Any Lugger owner should do same.
When ever you have a pairing where one boat must have an outboard for an auxiliary and the other can use oars, the human powered boat gets my nod. Invariably much more versatile
The Monty 15 is one of the best all around boats that I have encountered. Built solid, weatherly, fast. Only negative is that stub keel which prevents her from sitting flat on the beach.
A few readers have complained about “apples and oranges” matchups…but I hope they realize it’s impossible to organize this kind of elimination contest with nothing but similar designs. The Lugger vs. Monty 15 matchup is classic in that they both have huge followings and they’re in the same general size range, but they’re light years apart in other respects…suggesting we’ll continue to see at least different kinds of apples as we approach the final showdown. Anyhow, Lugger vs. Monty 15 is a really tough call: I have enormous respect for both designs, but I’ve got to go with the Montgomery 15, since I’ve owned one, know how well they sail in various conditions, appreciate their sleep-aboard advantages, and just love their overall design.
Well, this is like comparing the person you are happily married to someone you dreamed off back in high school. The Monty gets my vote- how could I betray her as she sits in my garage? About the best 15 ft cruiser there is- the cabin has no pretense of holding anything but a berth, but what a big and surprisingly comfortable berth it is (as I was once told, think of it as a supremely comfortable backpacking tent- I can't imagine another 15 footer that my wife would gladly chose over her bed at home), and she sails so well- leaving one cutting through waves, hiking stick in hand, laughing at all the tubbier boats hobby horsing in the chop. And if you have a question on the email group, Jerry- who build your boat in 1985- may ask for your number so he can call to talk through a repair you asked for advice on- and share some crazy stories too. And great build quality- I always enjoy getting to tell people who ask if she is new that no, she's older than you probably are... Oh, and pulling in and having her on the trailer and ready to take home in 30 min, and then offering your help to the friend still de-rigging a Catalina 22 who started an hour before you got there, there's a certain satisfaction in that too. True, you can nose her up to a beach, but don't want to ground her out at low tide, and yes, she's a two person boat- the cockpit looks like it has more room, but really, even three are a crowd and mess with sailing ability, and, no, she's not the boat to take around Vancouver Island- but dang she better win this whole dang thing. But yes, there is still the Dracombe, and I will admit- please don't tell my Monty- that sometimes I do still dream of her.
Wow, I think the left bracket was just a warm up. This first match up in the right bracket is the real deal.
I noticed the smaller boat usually won the matchup in the left bracket (exceptions are the WWP 15 vs Peep Hen and Sea Pearl 21 vs Ranger 20). Also, the winners are all cabin equipped boats except for the Sea Pearl, SF Pelican, and SCAMP. So, maybe I’ll vote for the DL just to buck the trend…
Out of all the boats in this madness I think the DL has the most soul and character. Despite it being a production boat I imagine one could really form a long friendship with this one. As miles passed under the keel a rich patina would develop on the hands and bronze alike.
How can you vote against the M15 though? It’s a fan favorite and proven to be capable. Well, for me it’s got two strikes against it. It’s just a little too small for my needs - I just want more waterline length and storage space. Also, the stub keel prevents beaching and shallow water exploring. I’ve already voted for the M17 anyway, so this round goes to the DL.
Wow! Drascombe leads with 53 percent after 128 votes cast. Tough draw for the Monty 15!
I am a bit bias about picking a Drascombe having owned 2 luggers, a Cruiser and now a Coaster.
I believe the Coaster to be a much better fit for this draw having a cabin for overnights and a large cockpit to spread out in. I have learnt over the years that the small lug sail on all these Drascombes is far more useful for more than just sailing.
Both great boats, but we like Lugger for her day sailing, muck about skinny water capabilities. Take 5 friends with you. Versatile sail plan. Viable rowboat and easy access to motor. Easy to rig. But if camping is your thing and a cabin is desired...
Full disclosure, Skipper has had her Lugger for 40 years.
Life is too short, why not both?
Of all the boats in this gunfight, there is one who clearly checks more boxes than any other, with respect to offering more joy to more people. I was an "associate member' of the old SOCAL Potters, and sailed regularly against and with Sean's band of Monty brigands to the east in Havasu. And I have been cruising with those delightful little spit kits consistently ever since. That I regularly managed to out foot and out point the lot of them with a similar pocket cruiser of my own frankenmanufacture I believe gives me a rare access to the catbird seat. Sure, they could be faster and more handy and easier to rig, even to get back on the trailer. But. Those little M-15's do more of the jobs listed, right out of the carton, than any other boat in this dog and pony show. Dan
This is painful. Without a doubt, Montgomery 15's are great, practical boats and crackerjack sailers, with a well deserved reputation for quality build, representing a very well chosen set of compromises for a boat of this size and type.
But, it is hard to vote against the Drascombe Lugger, even though I always thought Webb Chiles was more than a little crazy for attempting a long ocean voyage in one. Every time I read his book, I'd come away thinking, "Nope. Give me a solid little yawl (Gilmer's Blue Moon?) which will heave to or lie ahull like a well corked bottle when things get snotty, not something more like a small casserole dish with no lid just waiting to feed you to the sharks." But, dangit, the things just look *salty* in a way only designs derived from 19th century British fishing boats can, even if part of that look is a loose footed mainsail which would likely do much better with a well vanged boom, and a mizzen which wants a sprit boom or some other arrangement to make it useful for anything much more than a riding sail. Even with that tricky rudder arrangement (see Phil Boger's Chebacco and some others for a better way to achieve the same end, in my opinion), you just have to love the looks of 'em, hence my totally irrational vote. <;-)
I watched as elderly, but experienced, sailors capsized their lugger in about 8’ of water in early Oct. (Chesapeake Bay). Wind was 15kts gusting to 20. The boat immediately filled. Centerboard case was below the filled waterline. The boat then flooded freely through the centerboard case and the outboard well.The boat was unrecoverable and the couple had to be rescued, the boat pulled to shore to be bailed. This is an unsafe boat without signifcant modifications. Fails. Also boat is pokey slow in light airs.
We had a M-15 and a M-17. The M-15 was so much easier to tow, launch and retrieve, it was comfortable for the two of us to sleep aboard, and it handled heavy weather sailing very well. This is one of the boats I wish I would have kept, particularly now that we are 75. John and Joy
The Lugger is the best small sailboat in your contest. If I had bought this boat first she would have been my only sailboat. And saved me a small fortune.
I voted for the DL because it is more versatile, can probably carry more gear, has better sail combination choices, and is probably easier to set up at the launch ramp.
A cabin on that small of boat may be cozy, but it often gets in the way. Really, for a boat that size, a half-decked, or even an open boat, may be the better option, if it has high sides and sufficient emergency flotation.
Monty 15….I’ve had THREE!!! #318, #670,#742!! My all time favorite boats…They check off, ALL the boxes!…And I’ve had more than a few. (last count…somewhat north of 15)…were it not for the Monty’s, I would have voted for the Drascombe.
No problem making a Lugger self rescueable; we've been doing it with racing dinghies for years before fancy built in tanks. Any Lugger owner should do same.
When ever you have a pairing where one boat must have an outboard for an auxiliary and the other can use oars, the human powered boat gets my nod. Invariably much more versatile
The Monty 15 is one of the best all around boats that I have encountered. Built solid, weatherly, fast. Only negative is that stub keel which prevents her from sitting flat on the beach.